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Jason Mathias

The, "Asking for a friend" phrase.

I have noticed a lot of social media memes use the phrase, "asking for a friend" after they have hidden a false or misleading suggestion/claim into a question. The phrase seems to be used as a subtile manipulation tactic to help convince people of the false claim. Is this a logical fallacy or a cognitive bias at play here?

Example: 

"So... If shutting down Russia's Pipeline is suppose to cripple their economy, why did we shut ours down? Asking for a friend...."

Now, obviously this meme is trying to show a contradiction in Biden by telling us that Biden shutting down the XL Keystone Pipeline is the cause for our higher gas prices. And that him sanctioning Russias oil is a contradiction. But, its covert and not explicit so they can have plausible deniability. And the asking for a friend at the end seems to solidify the argument. What is this kind of manipulative phenomena thats happening here?

 

asked on Saturday, Mar 12, 2022 11:28:30 AM by Jason Mathias

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account no longer exists writes:

Call me dense, but I can't see how any of this (the OP and the discussion so far) "asking for a friend" thing describes a "logical fallacy." The use of the meme might be intended as a deception (manipulation) A logical fallacy might be deceptive, but a deception per se is not necessarily a logical fallacy. And too, if the use of the meme is based on factual ignorance (factual error) how is its use in any way an argument in logical form, i.e., premises -> conclusion?

Have I misread or misunderstood this discussion?

posted on Saturday, Mar 12, 2022 04:42:26 PM
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account no longer exists writes:
[To Prof M]

Mea culpa , I see that Jason addressed this concern in a later post. 

[ login to reply ] posted on Saturday, Mar 12, 2022 04:48:33 PM

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Answers

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Bo Bennett, PhD
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I despise the "asking for a friend" gambit. I bet some time in 1982, this was both funny and clever, but now has become a hackneyed phrase that shows lack of originality. I see this as simply a poor attempt at humor since it is clear the person is expressing their own views.

answered on Saturday, Mar 12, 2022 03:12:31 PM by Bo Bennett, PhD

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account no longer exists writes:

It depends of the question, of course, but "asking for a friend" could simply be because they think their question might be perceived as being stupid.

posted on Saturday, Mar 12, 2022 03:59:05 PM
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Bo Bennett, PhD writes:
[To Jim]

Fair point. I can see someone asking a stupid question and using that phrase as self-deprecation, admitting the question might be stupid. This is a far more honorable usage :)

[ login to reply ] posted on Saturday, Mar 12, 2022 04:04:05 PM
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account no longer exists writes:
[To Bo Bennett, PhD]

Also, to absolve them from any "retribution" for "being stupid" ! 

[ login to reply ] posted on Saturday, Mar 12, 2022 04:09:19 PM
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Jason Mathias writes:

[To Jim]

Yes, but in the case of a internet meme that everyone shares its not that. And as we can see according to logic we have to entertain the possibilities. And in that they can exploit a flaw in logic by plausible deniability. Is there anyway around this glitch in the logic matrix that can be exploited in this way? Plausible deniability. (of course they are lying to do this)

[ login to reply ] posted on Saturday, Mar 12, 2022 05:02:44 PM
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TrappedPrior (RotE) writes:
[To Jason Mathias ]

You're right - it could be someone expressing their opinion with added snark, and phrasing it as a question sarcastically. Especially given that it is a well-known meme.

However, being ignorant - and kind of arrogant, in this case - isn't mutually exclusive. It could easily be an uninformed Biden critic taking a passive-aggressive jab at the President. 

[ login to reply ] posted on Sunday, Mar 13, 2022 05:09:04 PM
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TrappedPrior (RotE)
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We must remember and consider the possibility that the person is genuinely mistaken. They might actually believe false/misleading/irrelevant claim X and thus bake it into their question. 

For instance, if they see 'shutting down Russia's pipeline' as an attempt to damage their economy, they might make this implicit argument:

P1) Shutting down Russia's pipeline will damage their economy

Implicit P) Shutting down pipelines damages economies

P2) We shut down our pipeline

C) Therefore we will damage our economy

You can take issue with  implicit P)  by arguing it is simplistic/ambiguous, and thus show there is no contradiction in Biden's actions. But it wouldn't mean they are deliberately being manipulative or sly. It would be a genuine misunderstanding.

In cases where someone is purposefully being sly, this is not a fallacy, but a form of  bad faith participation  where someone enters a debate with ulterior motives aside from seriously discussing the issue. But, as we've seen above, it is easy to confuse  bad faith  with innocent misconceptions made in good faith , so context matters here.

answered on Saturday, Mar 12, 2022 12:57:28 PM by TrappedPrior (RotE)

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Jason Mathias writes:

This is a popular meme being shared on FB right now. So, its not a persons claim per say.

What about adding in the, "Asking for a friend" part? This is a popular phrase and so we all know they are not asking for a friend. It has nothing to do with the argument so its a manipulation tactic. Perhaps an appeal to humor, or appeal to sarcasm? 

Also, Russia's economy is 60% oil. So, the majority of its economy is based on oil. If you take that away they lose 60% of their economy which is devastating. The U.S economy is 8% oil. So a false equivalence. And, the pipeline the meme is referring to is the XL Keystone pipeline. That was actually going to be Canadian oil, and it was to be shipped to Texas to be refined, and then it was to be exported overseas and was never even meant for U.S consumption. So, its a false meme. And I think the "asking for a friend" part makes the meme more appealing to accept and share. 

posted on Saturday, Mar 12, 2022 01:22:01 PM
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TrappedPrior (RotE) writes:
[To Jason Mathias ]

What about adding in the, "Asking for a friend" part? This is a popular phrase and so we all know they are not asking for a friend. It has nothing to do with the argument so its a manipulation tactic. Perhaps an appeal to humor, or appeal to sarcasm? 

They're probably not literally asking for a friend, so it is likely sarcasm. However, they might still genuinely be misguided by the situation. That would make them more likely to wonder why Biden  is  terminating the Keystone pipeline if cutting off pipelines 'destroys economies', even if the concerns are misplaced. 

Even if it's a meme, a meme can be founded on reasonable misconceptions. 

The core problem with the question is that its suppositions are factually incorrect, as you point out. So demonstrating that the question is faulty is sufficient in my opinion.

[ login to reply ] posted on Saturday, Mar 12, 2022 02:54:12 PM